Iraq

In short: forget the idea of a quick withdrawal from Iraq, such a slogan could doom our chances in November. The sad truth is that the US army is the only thing keeping the country together and that the moment we withdraw, all hell is going to break loose. Knowing that it is inevitable, this is something that we should be able to live with, but here is something that will be harder to live with: a 200+ dollars a barrel for oil which is certain to happen if we do this.

I am not sure people in the progressive movement realize how tight the oil market is, today we witnessed a price increase of 11$ in one day and all it took for that to happen was for the Israeli Minister of Transportation to say that an attack on Iran was inevitable. Just imagine what would happen if the US were to leave and turks, Kurds, sunni, Shia would duke it out.

If McCain says during the campaign that withdrawal from Iraq will double the price of gas, people will believe him, because it is essentially true.

It is not a diary for Barak as I am certain he is aware of the problem. It is for the blogosphere...

Withdrawal from Iraq is not a strong message any more.



Display:


Re: Iraq (2.00 / 1)

Are you kidding, it's one of the major fault lines between McCain and Obama. He's got to execute a full but orderly pullout within a year. There isn't going to be a civil  war because basically the Iranians have infiltrated the govt and will keep the lid on. Paradoxically the main domestic beneficiary of a pullout will be the Republicans. Iraq is an incubus that's doing the huge harm. Take it away and they are strengthened.


by ottovbvs on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 06:08:31 PM EST

Re: Iraq (none / 0)


That kind of argumentative finess doesn't work well in election.

Health care is a far better fault line.


by TaiChiMaster on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 06:10:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Iraq (2.00 / 2)

health care is only listed as the top issue for something like 8% of voters, then Iraq, then the Economy...

Obama had a good line in his speech: 'We need to be as careful leaving Iraq, as we were careless getting in.'  I don't think that a precipitous withdrawal is going to happen.  


by Lawyerish on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 06:21:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Iraq (none / 0)


I'm not talking about obama, I am talking about you (figuratively speaking) from the blogosphere.
by TaiChiMaster on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 06:22:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

A comment (2.00 / 2)

is not a diary. Opinion is not fact.


Bush murders soldiers for profit. McCain wants to wet his beak.
by awobbly on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 06:11:26 PM EST

Re: A comment (none / 0)


If you disagree just say so.
by TaiChiMaster on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 06:13:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

so (2.00 / 2)

eom


Bush murders soldiers for profit. McCain wants to wet his beak.
by awobbly on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 06:20:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Iraq (2.00 / 3)

I imagine it will be pretty ugly in Iraq after we leave.

However:
a.  It is pretty ugly there now.
b.  This in no way changes if we leave soon or if we leave a long time from now, IMHO.


by GreenHills on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 06:14:09 PM EST

Troll Framing? I don't believe it (2.00 / 1)

do you actually think any of us are going to listen to you? I do applaud your attempt however, to raise your situation in the blogosphere. What would be an appropriate title for a troll like you? Guess what, Americans want to withdraw, 2/3rds! Frame yourself out of that!
McCain does Not support the troops
by hope monger on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 06:15:30 PM EST

Re: Troll Framing? I don't believe it (none / 0)


Name calling, what a surprise!

As for your "assessment" (snark snark snark)... then why isn't Barak polling at 66% then.

but I am obviously wasting my time on you


by TaiChiMaster on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 06:17:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Troll (none / 0)


McCain does Not support the troops
by hope monger on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 06:16:50 PM EST

Oh and by the way (none / 0)


I almost got my ass kicked by a bunch of frat boy in a bar in 2003 because of irak while some of you were probably dreaming of the glorious time of WWII.
by TaiChiMaster on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 06:20:19 PM EST

I was just wondering... (none / 0)

before you had it translated at babelfish what language did you write the above post in?


by tonedevil on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 07:21:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I was just wondering... (none / 0)


Hum... since you are so good in english, is there a way I can give you the finger without having my comment deleted?
by TaiChiMaster on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 07:23:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

It seems to me... (none / 0)

you just did.


by tonedevil on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 07:58:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Iraq (2.00 / 1)

Thank you for your concern...


accepting McLettuce is like being 9 years old and forced to eat your own cooking
by Sychotic1 on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 06:27:01 PM EST

You are a troll. (2.00 / 2)

I don't particularly like slogans, but this one is fitting here.

No blood for oil.


Check out McCain.
by you like it on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 06:32:01 PM EST

Don't worry It was only a primary slogan (2.00 / 1)

Sen. Obama is not stupid he would never withdraw troops precipitously. It is a good strategy for winninng the caucuses. He wanted to make sure the party activists are with him.


You may not agree with What I say but don't forget I am a Democrat
by indydem99 on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 06:51:10 PM EST

Re: Iraq (none / 0)

"the moment we withdraw, all hell is going to break loose."

Uuhhhhh...Iraqi kids have been in Hell and dying since we invaded. Even forgetting the killings, rapes, loss of women's right and general breakdown of civil (secular) society...we still haven't gotten even things like electricity and garbage pick-up back to pre-invasion levels.

I don't know how you define hell, but the Iraqis are in hell and can't get out as long as we are there.


McCainuire, The Wrath Of Not Enough Naps.
by catilinus on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 07:10:16 PM EST

I disagree (none / 0)

For one...did you notice how stable prices were before Mr Bush took us into Iraq and Chaney had Exxon and Chevron write our energy policy?  Is this just coincidence?  If it looks like sh*t, smells like sh*t, then it is sh*t.

Of course if we or Israel attack Iran I would expect it to go even higher, probably $200 per barrel, which subsequently is what Bin Laden was praying for as he said it would ruin our economy and he is right.

I think the smartest thing to do is follow some plan like the bypartisan commission recommended to do and once Iraq is stabalized and we are out, their oil production will increase due to security and sabotage attacks not being such a big issue.


by netgui68 on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 07:40:27 PM EST

Re: Iraq (none / 0)

First, withdrawing troops within a year would mean doing it by 2010 at the absolute earliest. Call it due to the surge, call it due to the awakening, call it whatever you want, but the fact is that Iraq is getting much safer. It is NOT, however, making any political progress. Setting a timeline to withdraw troops (without holding off on providing crucial financial and moral support as happened in Vietnam) would help make that happen.

Meanwhile, Iran is the very reason that Iraq is a winning issue in this campaign. It appears ever more likely that we will be forced into war with Iran at some point. Maybe not this year, maybe not even the next, but unless there is a government upheaval, we face a government that is intent on a fight. Leaving our troops in Iraq only does them a favor, because it leaves us not only stretched from a military and fiscal perspective, it makes us weary as well. We need to be well-rested in the event of a war, because there's a decent chance that Iran won't do it alone. Russia's been looking for a fight as well, you see.

So yes, Iraq is a winning issue. We just have to make everyone realize exactly what John McCain said is true. There may well be other wars. We can't be fighting three at the same time. If we're worried about Iraq destabilizing following an orderly withdrawal, what about a hasty and panicked withdrawal?


If you're being chased by an angry bull and then you notice you're also being chased by a swarm of bees, it doesn't really change things. Just keep on running.
by vcalzone on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 08:10:57 PM EST

Re: Iraq (none / 0)

Meanwhile, his policy of diplomacy is a winner, too. Because what all great dictators understand is that diplomacy is essentially bullshit. It is not just meant for two countries, it is often meant for the world to see. And at this point in history, we NEED the world to see up open to negotiation. We NEED the world to see us trying to avoid a fight.


If you're being chased by an angry bull and then you notice you're also being chased by a swarm of bees, it doesn't really change things. Just keep on running.
by vcalzone on Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 08:13:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]


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